10 January 2025

More on Thuc

A bit more on my beloved Thucydides (c. 460 – after 400 BCE). He is known as the father of "scientific history," i.e., using analysis of events in their context to determine their significance, as opposed to storytelling. But he actually goes further than that. His aim is to discern patterns in historical events and to discover the "laws" (a bit too strong a word but I can't think of a better one) for human and societal behavior. That is to say, certain kinds of persons and states of certain polities will behave the same way in the same circumstances and situations. One chilling conclusion therefore is that democracies under stress will always turn to demagogues

In effect, Thuc was also the first social scientist, using the events of history as his empirical data. The intellectual ambition of such an undertaking is astounding; it would be today, all the more in the 5th century. One of the hallmarks of his history is his insertion of speeches at critical points. The speeches are made-up; he could not have witnessed them and virtually none of them would have a written record. But these are not flights of fancy. Rather he composes the speeches to show what he thinks must have been in the minds of individuals or the governments of states to account for their actions. He deduces motivations, attitudes, and beliefs from actions. The speeches are, in fact, how he presents the conclusions of his analysis. He wrote that his work was intended to be "a possession forever" for humanity. In that he succeeded.  What a guy!


8 comments:

  1. Yes, what a guy. And only 2,400 years ago. Maybe democracies will eventually learn from him.

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  2. We're caught in a recurrent pattern right now, alas.

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    1. Thuc would have had a field day if he were here for the past 15 years or so...

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  3. Remember, if it happened after 400 CE it is current events, not history.

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  4. You sure got that right, Sweetie! 👍

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  5. So do we ever learn from history or are we forever doomed to repeat the worst of it?

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  6. These days I tend to lean toward doom...

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